posted 06-20-2001 12:58 PM            

Sure, sometimes its an accident (bomb line), but maybe they should learn whennot to fire?

But mainly, this would be just for hte people who just dont care where they fire

posted 06-20-2001 03:53 PM            

This'll be just like seatbelt laws, it prevents idiots from killing themselves (or in this case, killing teamates)

posted 06-20-2001 07:24 PM         

bad idea
leave it to the mods

posted 06-21-2001 12:05 AM         

I like it. Too many people don't know how to play bomber and end up killing more teammates than enemies as it is. That's just what you get for mining inside your base.

posted 06-21-2001 02:33 AM            

But seriously .... I think it's the best idea anyone's had in a long time.

posted 06-21-2001 05:06 AM         

I'd say something like 8-10 because most are accidents, but if you do it 8-10 times you are just having too many accidents to be considered a good bomber. Maybe instead of speccing just put them in a fighter lol

posted 06-21-2001 09:16 AM         

Why penalise us wall bombers, OMFG That'd be so unfair to wall bombers, Very easy to accidently kill 3 ppl or more in tight bases, with Repels going off left + right + centre all times.

Do this and I'll change my game again i'll just sit behind everyone in my sweet corner with wide burst bouncys let the ppl in front take the hits and i'll grab the 1 shot kills.

This BOT's ruining the fun of SWZ, Lets keep SWZ human please !

Tail, Your making too many Major Rule changes to the zone, Slow down or Loss what veterans that are currently still playing in swz.

Ether way still love ya's all :P

------------------
Proud Member of Zaibatsu Squad

posted 06-21-2001 09:56 AM            

Let's try and keep this in persepective people...

posted 06-21-2001 11:58 AM            

Very few people in this zone know how to use bombers correctly. Auto specing them for team killing is a great idea. As of late most bombers that have tk'd me don't even take the time to say they are sorry for their actions.

The stupidest comment I often hear from bombers is oh well not my fault, it got repelled. It IS your fault if you lob a bomb at 15 rushing nme and they rep it.

It's time to hold bombers accountable for their stupidity. I really hope you implement this new feature TC.

And 4 sounds like the perfect number if you take out 4 teammates at once that's often 1/4 if not more of the team that's attacking/defending a base. I have too many times seen team kills like that be the cause of losing a flag game.

------------------
-justadecoy@zetasquad.com
-ICQ# 948699g a base. I have too man

posted 06-21-2001 12:34 PM            

And another question. Let's say one gets specced and there are no mods around, when will %tickname ( ) get out of spec then? 5 min penalty? game losing penalty? better yet, if they so much like to kill the players X, Y and Z on their own freq, move %tickname to the other freq, where kiling those 3 is legal

posted 06-21-2001 02:17 PM         

It doesn't act as a guard against intentional tk's, but more against stupidity. It really doesn't take much to tk 3 to 4 players on your team... just plant some mines when nme is attacking, lob some bombs up front where your team is all closely packed, and there you have it; 4 tk's, 5, 10, it just keeps going up.

If you really don't know when and where to shoot bombs in a bomber, you shouldn't be using one at all... The worse you are, the more often you will end up getting spec'd, and hopefully the sooner you will learn either how to use a bomber, or to just use a fighter.

I'm sure some peeps, even the best bombers, will end up getting spec'd with this rule, but hopefully they would learn to appreciate how much they are being saved from mindless aimless, no skill, zombie bombers who shoot bombs and anything and everything that moves, reguardless of what this does to their team.

SPEC THEM ALL!!!!!!!

posted 06-21-2001 03:49 PM            

Tail, please make it 4 TKs per game = a spec.

I'm tired of all these wallbombers doing sh|t for their team, killing pratically as many teamates as opponents, being detrimental to zone fun, bragging cuz of their W/L (they never mention their AVE though, its so low from the TKs ), and having the nerve to come here and complain about preventing their right to TK "8 to 10" teamates per game.

There isnt much that pisses me off more while flagging then when I'm busting my ass suiciding in a base trying to actually gain some ground when half of my teamates are sitting pretty outside chucking bombs at a wall when they could be helping *so much more* if they were at the front fighting it out with the rest of us. At the end of the day, sure their W/L isnt too shabby, but that means sh|t when their team just got raped and they did absolutely nothing to help.

posted 06-21-2001 10:33 PM         

quote:

---

Originally posted by FlyingFortress:

Tail, please make it 4 TKs per game = a spec.

Smart players dont mine tight corridors or bomb down a tunnel when there are tons of teamates around, youre just asking for TKs.

---

I disagree with the first part, and agree with the second.

That's why i say Spec ppl who team kill 4 people at once.... too much players just dont know where to put their mines...

But 4 team kills limit over an entire game isn't what zone needs.

There is still good wall bombers like MaverickPL, Darkest days i think and more. That are very usefull to the team and sometimes save the game bombing the Droid flag room because team just cant get to it.

posted 06-22-2001 02:09 AM            

Lets not forget how many times bombers bomb their teamates, damage them but dont kill them. Tha happens alot, way too often in fact.

posted 06-22-2001 07:36 AM         

quote:

---

Originally posted by FlyingFortress:
If you TK more than 3 times per game then you're obviously being a nuisance for your team.

---

LOL !

I have seen numerous battles where wall bombers where a major factor that made my freq win. This includes when the opponents reach the last gate of droid, this place is one that is easily bombable. From the inside and the outside of the base. I prefer bombing from the outside but i have seen usefull bombers bombing from the inside getting repelled and TKing themselves over and over again but that is not a problem, because those numerous warbirds cant damage the nme when the gate is close. And to win we must keep the pressure on the nme. Im not saying we need more wallbombers, im saying that a team needs all 3 kinds of ships. In the example of droid where the bombers that are keeping pressure on the nme TKs 3 times during that battle it doesn't mean they need to get specced.

posted 06-22-2001 03:39 PM            

I hate it when my teamates bomb there while Im defending, because as anyone with flagging smarts can tell you, the best way to defend a base is to push the nme out, not hold your ground. By having teamates bomb that gate area, they're just hurting players like me who actually do try to pass through those corridors and push the nme out.

posted 06-22-2001 06:43 PM         

I'm guessing many Asian region based players have a tough staying on 1 frequency long enough to win a game, most time I lagged just 1-2 minutes before we win game and big jackpot. Now we know why this happens much more often now, cause of TC's setting change implemented awhile-back " Say GOOD BYE LAGGERS ". You bring this change in it'll just get much worse, Really sad Losing JP cause of bad lag, it'll much worse feeling cause of Accidental kills.

Really do think Bombers should be respected in their rightful place in game tactics, they work well and in quiet a few base are essential to quicker success.

What next Rules restricting other ships? J

Just because you have the power doesn't mean you must use it.

Why' don't you take those lamer thors out Tail ?

Most ppl believe that they're not really used for RED flager base sniperings.

------------------
Proud Member of Zaibatsu Squad

posted 06-22-2001 10:25 PM         

The fact is that when a cap stands in the upper corner neat the last gate of droid, he can recharge a lot of energy when the gate is close, but if me and MaverickPL are bombing him, i wont kill a single team mate bombing that corner. He will loose a lot of energy to bombs, or at least be unable to recharge. If you can't understand the strategic advantage of wall bombing well it's ok.

And for the ppl who insinuate I always team kill when im wall bombing, you are so wrong people. What i was pointing out is that in the worst case, in a game that lasts 1 hour, team kill could go up to 8.

This will probably be my last post about this topic because i don't want to : "be right". I as just trying to make my opinion about this topic clear so that zone staff that is curently studying the possibility of an Auto Team Kill Spec bot.

Also what i'd like to point out is that most ppl that agree for the bot are frustrated by the fact that newbies sometime play bombers.

And if someone wants to start a topic about wall bombing that is not in relation with this Speccing Bot, be sure i will post in it.

PS. FF, flame me if it makes you feel better.

posted 06-22-2001 10:59 PM         

quote:

---

Originally posted by FlyingFortress:
Me likes. But set it to 4 TKs. A repped mine can easily take out 3 teamates during an intense battle.

---

Don't take it personnal FF but it is against that kind of people we need a rule. People that dont know how to place mines kill a lot of team mates and RARELY kill an ennemy because of the omnipresence of repellers.

quote:

---

Originally posted by BloodDrinker
:
Too many people don't know how to play bomber and end up killing more teammates than enemies as it is. That's just what you get for mining inside your base.

---

Yeah exactly, the problems is bombers that don't know how to place mines and who kill a lot of people in a short time.

quote:

---

Originally posted by just a decoy :
As far as mines go DON'T LAY THEM inside a tight tunnel 90% of the time they DO get repelled. As as far as ruining the fun for lame ass wall bombers, that's great news.

---

just a decoy seems to agree that the main problem is mines where they shouldnt be. But seems very frustrated against wall bombers, probably because he/she is playing freq 1 mostly and lost a few battles because of them.

Here comes some comments with a different vocabulary, a way more rude vocab.

quote:

---

Originally posted by FlyingFortress :

I'm tired of all these wallbombers doing sh|t for their team

---

Here FF means that Wall bomber are useless to their team because they kill "as many teamates as opponents". That is false. Not only do they kill at least 20 opponents per team mate killed but they also attract mos of the time about 2 ennemy fighters per wall bomber that will just try to chase him. You do the math. And, if this debates turns into a which players are usefull for their team, the centerkillers need to be blamed more than wall bombers fo sure.

quote:

---

Originally posted by FlyingFortress :
There isnt much that pisses me off more while flagging then when I'm busting my ass suiciding in a base trying to actually gain some ground when half of my teamates are sitting pretty outside chucking bombs at a wall when they could be helping *so much more* if they were at the front fighting it out with the rest of us. At the end of the day, sure their W/L isnt too shabby, but that means sh|t when their team just got raped and they did absolutely nothing to help.

---

A lot of trash talk... Seems that half of FF's freq is wall bombing. But tell me FF which freq are u playing on ? (see above and look for the paragraph about usefullness of wall bombers)

quote:

---

Originally posted by FlyingFortress :
If you TK more than 3 times per game then you're obviously being a nuisance for your team.

---

Ah, im happy your back to some polite language. And since you're back to the usefulness topic see above...

quote:

---

Originally posted by FlyingFortress :
Lets not forget how many times bombers bomb their teamates, damage them but dont kill them. Tha happens alot, way too often in fact.

---

That is a very good argument. And i agree with it. But it isnt related to the speccing bot unless we can do some kind of Team Damage kinda thing.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wild :
wallbombers (from both sides) annoy me.
i'd like to see idiots specced after 4 tk's, and people with no aim too

---

Oh sorry, im only to repost arguments here right?

quote:

---

Originally posted by FlyingFortress
:
because as anyone with flagging smarts can tell you, the best way to defend a base is to push the nme out, not hold your ground.

---

Exactly, but with the nme cap that is holding that corner from the first little think on the north wall, being there is keeping is aim perfect and he kills you, everytime the gate opens you get flooded with nme bullets, and you die unable to reach nme cap. and each time the door closes he recharges to full energy. If you got bomber bombing him he can rely on the little thing because he need to stay away from walls you can now repell him effectively, go through the gate and kill him.

posted 06-22-2001 11:39 PM            

Anyway, i think we're straying off topic by debating the usefulness of wallbombers... thats another debate altogether.

The reason why I'm supporting the idea of having a bot take care of players who TK multiple times is because it will force bombers to be more cautious. Good players should have no problem with this, as they should be able to aim their bombs away from teamates. Its as simple as that. If youre a bomber, dont bomb your teamates. Easy concept. If you know that you can kill an nme with 1 bomb but might risk hurting a teamate, you dont shoot. Use a good judgement. What if the teamate you TK had a port in the nme flagroom? Its not worth it.

posted 06-23-2001 12:13 AM            

How about after the second team kill the bot gives a warning, third team kill a scorereset, then fourth team kill.. spec.

posted 06-23-2001 02:35 AM         

8-10 tk a game is reasonable due to the fact that a good bomber (or at least a reasonable one) will realize that they are not being effective to the overall effort of raiding a base.

A lot of references are being made to the Driod base, but what about Frog? Thats the exact opposite. Most TKs in Barking Frog are due purely to bombers just not thinking about mine placement, or just randomly tossing a bomb down a corridor/wall *hoping* it hits an nme before tis rep'd.

posted 06-23-2001 12:50 PM            

Say you play for 3 hours, you "can have" (rather not of course ) 6 TKs during that time. (number values are examples, I'm not the one who makes the final decision...phew )

Or the SC thing is also a good idea, transferred into a fighter after X tks.....

posted 06-24-2001 01:47 AM            

188 kills.
4.2 mil pts.
0 TKs.